Straight From the Bottle

I hear you sister.  We have always rented and I hate when people tell us it's 'throwing money away'.  Um, we have a place to live that's comfortable so no, it's not.  If we owned we'd be foreclosed and living in a box so thanks, but we'll stick with what we've got going now.

We too have dreams of owning a home in the neighborhood we want.  It will happen for all of us.  Someday.

Good luck on CL!!  :-)

Homeownership is OVERATED!!!!  We are STUCK in our tiny started home tip this shit turns around. I'd give anything to have the luxury of moving to a larger home right now.  Enjoy your freedom! Have fun house hunting!!

Trust me, I understand how you feel!  We actually own a home, but are dreaming of selling it and going back to renting.  Sounds crazy eh?  Well when you shell out sooooo much per month for the mortgage, taxes, heating, water, etc...and know that you would save roughly $1000 a month renting...it does NOT sound like throwing money away.  It would mean me being able to stay home full time without the stress of knowing that Peter is working round the clock (and me starting to work again on the weekends) just so we can scrape by.  

I am an obsessive craigslister myself...the boyfriend and I are not ready to move out of my 1-bedroom apartment (and have no real reason to at the moment), but that doesn't stop me from feverishly scouring the listings.  And attending open houses.  Just for fun.

we obsessed over craigslist for a few days and found the house that we love agreeably. For us, in our area we can buy right now if we want to but i don't know- we don't want good enough. good enough is for renting. we want to buy and be in head over heels crazy love with the home we buy and that hasn't happened yet. Sure we are paying $700 more than what we paid but the SPACE- and NO SHARED WALLS! and omfg- A BIG BACKYARD AND FRONTYARD. and I have an organic veggie garden- sigh! All worth it! this is the year of saving. the old man got a bigger than huge promotion so we are living the same and putting the rest into downpayment savings. buying a home is scary- renting not so much right now....

Right there with you!  Granted, I live in the Midwest (i.e., NOT the land of almost a million bucks for under a thousamd square feet), but for us to buy right now, between mortgage+interest, property tax, PMI, and possible condo fees, it would mean our monthly payment would be between 150% and 200% of what we pay for rent now, PLUS having to fix anything that goes wrong out of our own pockets.  To me, it's still totally worth it to rent.

Glad to know that I am not the only Craigslist obsessed Hollywood renter.  I keep expecting that one day I will refresh the listings and the PERFECT apartment will fall from the sky into my lap.  And hey, according to almost half of the news I read real estate prices are still falling in Los Angeles.

Yep, I totally get it.  My hubby and I will be renting until the time is right for us to buy.  So, right now, that means renting indefinitely.

Ooh, I love that rug.

And I'm glad I don't live in LA.

Here across the ocean the situation is exactly the same, if there's any consolation in sharing your house misery -- totally feeling your pain, sistah.  In England (where it costs $5USD for a litre of gasoline...fun times!) house prices are BADONKulous expensive too.  We're a family of four as well, and we'll be renting for a long, long time.

I'm married to someone who's so anti-homeownership it's INSANE. Especially since we, too, live in Cali where homes are so expensive that it's just not realistic or smart to invest in real estate right now. (He actually has this insane, nerdy spreadsheet that does the math...)

Also! The market, especially in Cali, hasn't bottomed out yet. Homes are gonna get even cheaper...No need to jump in now.

Power to da renters, baby!

Whoa... LA is so expensive!... Good luck! I think what you're doing makes a lot of sense.

We own our home, and I have to tell you that at times, it's a real pain in the ass.  Leaky pipes, leaky roof, fleas, buckling floors and other little "perks" and there's no one to call that will just take care of it.  On their dime.  The American Dream can be overrated at times.

We are stuck in a transitional neighborhood where the development has come to a halt and the unsold homes are way cheaper than what we paid for ours. How I wish we were renting!

BTW, I love the rug on the picture.

Not the point, I know, but Archer gets up to pee?  At age 4? That's a triumph!

Housing can be crazy expensive. Hope you find something rental or otherwise, what about changing hoods?

Okay so I totally hear you. And $880K is just absolutely insanely astronomical. But if you could find someplace a little more in this stratosphere, you could do it! And then you'd own it and start building equity and all that good stuff.

Because here is the secret "they" never tell you: you don't have to put 20% down!!!! In fact, for first-time homebuyers, there is a fantastic program through the FHA that allows you to put 3.5% down. And if you close before 11/30/09, you'll get an $8,000 tax credit!

So if you can find a house where its cost means your monthly payments wouldn't be crazy high, putting 3.5% down is very do-able.

How do I know all this? My hubby and I are actually in escrow on our first home, taking advantage of this fantastic FHA program and getting ready to receive that $8K tax credit.

When we found out you could put down 3.5% -- or even 5% if you want to go for a conventional mortgage -- instead of freaking 20% (because WHO has 20% to put down on a house? COME ON), we felt like we'd been hit over the head with an anvil. And feel like WHY DIDN'T ANYONE EVER TELL US THIS? We had to find it out a most circuitous route.

So, even if you and your famiglia decide this isn't the route for you and stick to renting, I hope someone out there reading the comments is helped by this. I know that I sure wish I had known about a non-20%-down option years ago!

I recently found my dream house...with asbestos siding!

So while it's cute, in a great neighborhood and kind of affordable--no one will finance it. And I don't really have hundreds of thousands of dollars lying around in cash. (Wish I did. It would make all this house-hunting stuff much easier.)

Good luck! I hope you refresh your way into a perfect house soon!

We just got pre-approved for a home loan and have, kinda, starting looking around. However, in trying to do research online, I came across all these stories about families who bought homes only to discover they were filled with black mold or were former meth factories some other awfulness. At least when you're renting, you can walk away from a craphole. When you own it, you're stuck.

Love the rug. Love, love it!

We rent, too (in Chicago). It's our only option right now, and, when I hear about all the headaches homeowners have, I appreciate many aspects of renting. I'd love to be able to paint and to feel that it's worth it to invest in some better furnishings and home decor (right now, we plan to give our living room furniture away when we move next), but renting gives us far more peace of mind and mobility than owning would. And isn't being able to pack up and go a part of the American dream, too? Free, free, free, once you're done with the lease. =)

Oh lord, your down payment is more than my mortgage. We live in a 3 bedroom duplex in Denver we bought last year for 126k. Our mortgage is less than a thousand a month. What a difference location makes! You'll do it eventually, enjoy your home!

See, this drives me crazy.  People, by and large, are intimately familiar with the details of their OWN financial lives, and are generally in the best position to make decisions about said OWN financial lives.  

And I was shocked when you wrote that you were buying in L.A.  I don't know anybody not-famous who owns in L.A., but then I remembered that you ARE famous!  Hee.  You just have such an informal style, and write about such personal things, that I forget.  (I loved loved loved your book, and though you're a tad younger than I, I may have a couple of passages stuck in my bedroom mirror, because though young, you know What's Up.)

Anyway.  I like your zen about the whole thing.  You WILL buy when the time is right, and people should give less advice.  And congratulations on moving to a place that better suits your fam, whether you pay a rent or a mortgage payment.

(Ditto Kayt re: L.A. down payment more than my house.  By about $60K.  However, I live in Oklahoma, so there's your tradeoff!  Heh.  We don't even have a Whole Foods, much less all the other fruity hippie goodness you have out thar.  :)

Good for you!  Don't get sucked in.  We bought a house two years before my son was born, and now I realize, whoops, this neighborhood is horrible and I don't want my son growing up here.  Like everything else, you know what's right for you and taking your time is sooo smart.

We're in the same boat. Currently my husband and I are constantly texting and on the phone about what new posting is up on craigs list or whatever offers are around our neighborhood. It's frustrating because I JUST WANT TO MOVE RIGHT THIS VERY SECOND ALREADY, but the work will pay off.

Also, I am very very grateful we're not house hunting in LA. 880k? Yikes!

Best of luck!

we're looking in phoenix & it is crazy-expensive here, as well. not quite as much as l.a., but way more than we want to pay. and we need a 4 bedroom house. we're renting for now & may continue to do so b/c of the cost.

Totally feel this right now.  Just me and the hubs, no kids, but we are not considering buying anything for a long time!  Houses in New England are CRAZY expensive for not a whole lot.  We have enough for a down payment, but all those other fun costs (closing, repairs, updates, new furniture, heat, etc) would kill our standard of living and we would have to scrap by.  

My main thing, though, is how much TIME home-ownership takes.  My parents and in-laws spend countless hours on home maintenance and necessary projects.  I'm not sure we want to spend our time like that when we start a family. I'm not sure I want to worry about the state of the yard or calling the plumber when I've just had a baby and my whole world is upside-down.

So, we rent. And one day, we'll buy  But we are NOT throwing our money away, no matter what anyone says.  In fact, with all that money we saved by NOT buying a house this year, we're going to Italy for two weeks next Sunday. Woohoo!

I agree with others here. I am an owner, but my husband and I often fantasize about selling our house to someone who would take proper care of it and then we'd rent it back. We pay less per month than we might if we rented (that's not true for everyone, we just live somewhere with cheap housing), but it doesn't include the cost of our time. Neither of us takes any pleasure in maintaining the house, mowing the lawn, replacing the windows, etc. Heck, I don't like to vacuum or paint walls, why did I think I'd like the rest of it? So, we save money by owning (or, more accurately, by buying from the bank), but we don't like it. The financial planners might disagree, but renting has real advantages.

Dena - while you have a good point about down payments and rebates and tax credits, the less they put down, the more their mortgage is going to be!! 3.5% off $880,000 is still somewhere around $850,000. Do you realize what kind of mortgage payment that would be?!!?! INSANE! I don't know their financial situation, but somehow, like most of us, I doubt that's in their affordable range. And I doubt that there's anything in LA that fits what they need and is priced any better!

My bf and I are renting as well, and will be for a looooong time. Houses in our neighborhood range from 800,000 to 1.3 million. As much as I fantasize about owning one of them, for us, for now, it's highly unlikely.

Rebecca, if you can rent the sort of place you want, then I say go for it. Don't rush in and get in over your heads. It sounds like you're going about things the right way for your family and your situation right now. People taking on more than they can really handle and/or getting seduced by toogoodtobetruebecausetheyare deals is how we all got into this ecomomic crisis mess to begin with.

we are renting too, although we've been looking to buy for almost two years. as one commenter said above, i'm not looking to spend ALL my savings and go hundreds of thousands of dollars into debt for "good enough" - it has to be perfect, or at least something we love enough to not care that it isn't perfect. we're expecting our first baby in january and i was obsessed with the idea of moving so that we'd own our own home by the time baby arrived, but it's gotten so late that we've decided to postpone our search (again) and just be at peace with where we are for now. we have decent landlords, a fairly spacious home, and a nice location - i can't make myself crazy over every little thing.

As addictive and appealing as CL is, don't you think you should get real a estate agent working for you? CL only shows a mere fraction of what's on the market. A good agent knows what's coming on the market ahead of time so you can get in there early before open houses start.

Sorry! Now I realize you are looking for APARTMENTS on CL. Nevermind :)

Dude. I just got done watching some home buyer show on the H&G channel and I so feel your pain. San Francisco aint no joke in terms of surreal estate. And we have done lots of hand wringing like you especially after we had our 2nd kid. But. If you cant afford it, its better to rent than end up effed like so many other people have over the last couple years.

At some point I realized that I have never been on the same time line as anyone else, so why do I all of a sudden need to buy a house? My point is, it will happen for you. And when it does, its going to freaking rock and be worth the wait.

Well,

We're losing our house right now, and though I'm sad and tired of moving, I couldn't be more relieved to return to renting. We won't be responsible for maintenance and will be paying a little over half the amount of our mortgage for rent. And the house is bigger and in a nicer neighborhood, one without a halfway house one block away! I want stability for my kids, but I feel like my husband and I provide that--the house is just a house. Anyway, I wish you luck and think twice before buying an old house because even though it's pretty, the repairs will kill you.

I'm right there with you. We are happily renting in Studio City and would love to buy but it's that damn down payment that makes it so tough. And like you, I'm not willing to relocate to the boonies...no way, no how.

Drop me an email if you ever want to have your darling family photographed...my treat. It's not a house but it would be something to hang on the wall when you do get your house. :)

This will make you feel justified renting even more than you do now.

www.nytimes.com/.../2007_BUYRENT_GRAPHIC.html

I don't think renting is wasting money at all really. When we die we won't be taking anything with us; our house, our money, etc.

Dude, up here in Santa Barbara proper it's similar.  Which is why we live outside of Santa Barbara, where a three-bedroom can be had for $300,000 and change.  Of course, when we bought, we paid $400,000 plus.  :-P

I have to admit I've never lived in a house before.  I was born an apartment dweller and love the fact that someone else takes care of the lawn and the laundry room and if/ when something breaks, I can just call maintenance to come fix it.  Throwing away money?  Maybe.  But you get a whole lot fewer headaches out of the deal.  And that's a good deal to me.

renting is not so bad :).  we are homeowners, and like some of the other comments, sometimes dream of going back to renting.  when something needs repair, you don't have to pay to fix it...or wait until you have enough money to replace it.  i mean i love our house, and i'm thankful that our kids have their own rooms, but sometimes it can be a pain!  i guess there are positives to both renting and owning...

I cannot believe I am going to say this, but I wish we were renting too.  We tried to refinance our home and they told us we owed more than 35K over what it is now worth - according to "their chart".  Now we are praying they give us a loan restructure which will either reduce interest, or what we owe.  sigh.  Unless I get a better job soon we are really losing ground.

Everyone kept telling to to buy a house during the boom but I just couldn't afford it.  I wanted to make sure that I could afford a house and a life and any repairs wouldn't break me.  So I waited and now that I own a house I can afford and can imagine living in for a very long time while my friends are not able to sell their over priced starter homes.

The rug is from IKEA.  (I have the same one in my daughter's room and I love it!)

My husband and I went through the same thing in New York City -- toughed it out in a one-bedroom with a baby until we realized that we would never be able to buy, not even our little one-bedroom.  We moved back to the South, where we are originally from, and were able to buy a 4-bedroom house for less than that NYC apartment.  If moving to a less expensive area isn't an option (for whatever reason) then renting is definitely the best thing to do!

“In the meantime? We'll happily rent. And what a blessing it is that we can afford to do that.”

^^I love that you wrote that. So very true.

And I disagree as well with the thought that if you rent a place you're wasting money. Sure by owning a home you benefit a bit more in that one day it'll be yours but that's really necessarily true. Even if you paid for the whole house: there's still those monthly taxes that must be paid on the house (That’s the joy of living in the states, “nothing is ever really yours”). Plus, owning a house comes with more costs, if you buy a fixer upper. So all in all whether you rent or buy, "You're still spending money, because that's life. Everything revolves around money unfortunately."

Question: are you planning on renting a house or a big apartment? Either way, good luck! I hope you find something great for the fams! =D

P.S. “doing neighborhood drive-bys” << I loved that. =P

Have you considered moving outside of Hollywood?  We live in Valencia.  25 minutes to Hollywood and we can afford an extra bedroom we don't even need.  Yes, we are out of the excitement, but we're close enough that it doesn't hurt and, honestly?  My kids and I can walk to a park without every walking on a street (seriously, god bless whoever invented the paseos).  It's nice. And honestly, I can get to Santa Monica faster than my friends in Echo Park can.

We dreaded the move out of the city - I didn't want to be a suburban mom - but now it's nice.

I realize you haven't asked for advice on this, and don't even know where you want to live - but I know of someone who has a big 3 bedroom house (one extra room that could be used as a 4th bedroom, too) on Laurel Canyon, and it's on half an acre.  The only thing is that she's asking like $5K a month to rent it - which basically took my breath away when I heard that part. I haven't lived in L.A. for a year now and even the thought of paying $2k a month for rent makes me feel like falling over.  

So anyway. Completely unsolicited advice, but if it sounds like something you'd be interested in, feel free to email me and I'll hook you up with the person who owns the house.

We bought our first home (a townhouse) some 13 years ago. It was financially difficult and we lived an hour from where hubby worked.  But 13 years later we are happy we got into the market when we did.

The home selling market here in BC slowed for a time but is on the uptake. We have made at least $100,000 on our home. Does it suck that my hubby works so far away and is gone 3 days and nights a week  HELL YEAH.

Whatever works best for you all...

After stumbling upon, and falling in love with, your blog I bought your book. For two days I was obsessed with page turning. I gave a copy to one of my friends and she feel in love, too.  So, here's to hoping that millions of others find your book, and it rains Benjamins which will fall into a lovely pile resembling a down payment.

I live 5 minutes from st pete beach in Florida where I could not afford to buy a house in 2005.  I bought my house in April of 08 when prices dropped and my mortgage including taxes and insurance is lower than rent.  Until or unless you can own for cheaper than renting then renting is the way to go. Its non-commitment and its cost effective.

Too many people do not make sound financial decisions and allow their emotions to take over regarding home purchases.  Its just the 4 walls...just like a car has 4 wheels.

try padmapper.com

!!!

it just places craigslist ads on a map for you! its still scouring craigslist but with a day or two of novelty and joy!

We shopped for a house in CA a few years ago right at the exact height of the boom (thank the gods we smelled a rat and chose to keep renting).  "Find something more affordable" was my in-laws' refrain, sent across interstate telephone wires from a place where $150,000 could buy you a McMansion on 5 acres.  They JUST DIDN'T GET IT.  It's California, fer crying out loud, "affordable" is kind of a joke. You're going to be paying through the nose for it, wherever it is; you might as well plant your roots in the neighborhood you love.  

I say this as someone who moved back across the country to the Midwest in search of a more affordable place to live and eventually got stuck in the South.  We bought because it was cheaper than renting (thanks to some FHA programs) but 18 months later we find home ownership not even close to the world of rainbows and unicorns that it was supposed to be. The house that seemed so nice at first has turned out to be all wrong for us and I have grown to hate our neighborhood.  But guess what?  We can't just ride out our lease and move!

You're never "throwing money away on rent" - you will always need a place to live, and unless you can find some very nice cardboard boxes and a very comfy freeway overpass, you will always have to pay for it.  Who really stays in one place for a 30-year mortgage anymore? And ask someone who's underwater on their mortgage about all the equity they've got.  

Rebecca - there is a great add-on to Firefox called Grease Monkey that lets you search craigslist by pictures instead of just by text.  It saved so much time for us when looking for our rental! You can find it here:

http://www.greasespot.net/

I am in the same stressful situation, not being able to afford anything in our nabe, which is great for schools ,parks, and children. I'm sorry.

Where is that great rug from?

Great rug!

from one renter with four kids, hang in there.

is that a willy wonka reference i smell?

KEEP RENTING!

www.smartmoney.com/.../renting-makes-more-financial-sense-than-homeownership-21111

That's a drag to have your heart set on owning your own home and then not have the lucre to make the dream work. Two kids sharing a bedroom, one of them a baby who wakes up and screams at the slightest disturbance? And a little boy who would probably love to have his own room with a place to store all his stuff and play without being harassed by baby sister? Not good at all.

If my parents hadn't given me their lake house when I graduated from law school we wouldn't have been able to afford the beautiful house we have now, or the rental home that may one day become our retirement home when we kick the tenants out and knock down a few walls.

There are so many good things about owning a home in a good neighborhood -- like privacy and peace of mind and equity to hand down to the kids someday. rents are so high in our area that it costs almost as much to rent a crappy apartment as it does to pay the mortgage on our big house.

The down payment is the rough part for many young couples. Are your relatives willing to kick in anything?.

Yay for renting!

how is the cooper anyway?

and way to rub it in aradia. sheesh.

Renting is fine and home ownership is fine! :)  

But - we are in Elysian Valley and bought for under $300k!  We got an FHA loan, put 3.5% down and our interest is 5%.  Our payment, which includes the insurance and property tax is under $2k a mos and we have a lovely home with amazing neighbors!  The schools are both ranked 7 out of 10 and greatschools.com and we are both really happy here.  We are on the border of Echo Park and Silverlake, so it's a pretty sweet area.  You may want to check it out - it appears to be the latest artist area too so it's starting to have an art walk every year.  :)

But as I started out - renting is totally fine!  Just trying to get more cool people in the neighborhood!  :)