Strollerderby

I home school my kids.  Most of my friends who home school are college educated with advanced degrees, are atheist or pagans and their kids are at least 1-2 grades ahead of same aged peers stuck in public school.  MOst families I know that home school do it because their kids are gifted or have learning disabilities that public school will not address.  The gifted programs in our local schools are a joke.  Today my 6 year old studied Japanese, plant biology, ancient human history, 1st grade math, penmanship, read a book to me and helped me walk the dogs.  Then we had lunch.  What did your kids learn this morning?  More and more parents are homeschooling because our schools are terrible.  She has lots of friends she see reguarly so socializing is taken care of.  Besides, in public school she was not allowed to talk most of the time, sit with friends at lunch or play games at recess.  They just stood around she said.  They were able to bully each other, hit each other, learn new dirty words and publically humiliate each other with the blessing of the teacher when they broke a rule.  When we have home school play group we go to exercise classes, play games at the park, visit the zoo, go rock hunting and lots of other social activities.  Sure there are a few fundamentalist home schoolers and like most fundie groups they hollar the loudest so they get the most attention.  Every working mom I know wishes they could homeschool their kids.  I am very lucky and I love it.  Next time, read up on a subject before you write about it.  The history of education in this country is not what you may think.  

www.johntaylorgatto.com

I'm with Alice, and my husband and I plan on (and are looking forward to) homeschooling our children- and for non-religious reasons.  I understand the common misconceptions, as I once had them ALL myself, but with a little (or a lot of) research and an open

mind,  what you will discover may startle you, and will most likely change your assumptions about home educating families-it certainly did for me.

These are great starting places:

~Dumbing Us Down by John Taylor Gatto (as mentioned above)

~The Parents Guide To Alternatives In Education by Ronald Koetzsch

~The Homeschooling Handbook by Mary Griffith

Don't forget to question your assumptions and ask yourselves how much you really know about something before making swift judgments. There is so much there to uncover!

" Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire. "

-- William Butler Yeats

Amy, we're not so scary once you take a little time and get to know us :)  That is, if you really do have an open mind about the subject!

You are fooling yourself (and that is fine) if you think you can provide a complete education for your child simply because you are an adult.  I certainly wouldn't take my kids to my neighbor to have a cavity looked at or try to fill their prescriptions myself.  I am of the opinion that teachers are trained professionals and offer my children a service for which I am grateful.

As a member of the public education profession, I can tell you honestly that time and again I see students whose parents realize they can't be everything to their children and enroll them in school only to find them socially inept and years behind academically.  As a parent, I understand how tempting it is to want to control my child's every encounter but I frankly find it selfish.

Every parent does what they think is right for their children.  I just find it frustrating when society has to fill in the holes when new trends fail kids.

I know a lot of homeschooling families, and love some of them dearly, but the common denominator in each is an inability to let go of total control over their children - what they hear, see, do and experience.  

Actually it is about control.  Not wanting my kids to be controlled by strangers with agendas.  Our school system teaches a Virtue Curriculum which includes "Respect for the Creator".  No thanks.  I want my kids to learn about evolution without the waters being muddied by creationism baloney.  Why not have a say in what your kids hear, see and experience?  Dont you screen their internet activities, tv watching, friends?  That is your job as a parent to guide your child and teach them.  I have advanced degrees in science and math so I feel more than qualified to teach my children.  I also do what many professional teachers do while in school, I read a lot about education, teaching methods, and child psychology.  I wanted my children to be able to socialize with other kids, not learn to jump when the teacher says jump, to learn to feel bad about themselves because they did not get a smiley face from her that day.  I want my children to feel good about learning a new skill or reading a book.  I want them to have friends of all ages and backgrounds not just a group of the same age from the same socioeconomic tier.  I want my children to feel it is okay to talk in the hallways, that making mistakes is okay when we learn from them and that public humiliation is not okay to control them.  My oldest was punished in Kindergarten for fighting back when a boy bullied her.  They left her in the school copy room for most of the day all alone.  Worst of all all the other kids knew it and after that she was labeled "bad" and her friends rejected her for fear they would get into trouble as well.  After that I wondered just what was the school system teaching our kids.  How can she learn to read when she is worried about such nonsense?  To me teachers are strangers we place our children with for most of their day.  I dont know what they think, what they say when I am not there.  I am just going to trust the school system to pick the person best qualified to spend all day shaping my childs' mind?  Would you let strangers pick a nanny for your child?  Heck no.  Then why leave your child with teachers, bus drivers, other children and administrators you don't know either?  Public school is fine for some kids but not for us. I know some parents cant wait to send their kids off to school to get their "Me time" back but I decided it was more important that I postpone my plans for myself a bit longer to home school.  Besides, my oldest daughter is 2 grades ahead of all of her public shcool friends now and she still sees them several times a week to play.

"I dont know what they think, what they say when I am not there.  I am just going to trust the school system to pick the person best qualified to spend all day shaping my childs' mind?  Would you let strangers pick a nanny for your child?  Heck no.  Then why leave your child with teachers, bus drivers, other children and administrators you don't know either?"

Yup.  That pretty much sums it up.  

On a related topic, it's really interesting to me that this movement is gaining in popularity at the same time the "Free Range Kids" movement is gaining traction - or at least press.  I can't decide if they are two sides of the same coin or just diametrically opposed movements.  

I always wonder about the financial aspects of homeschooling.  We're very lucky in that my husband and I have solid jobs where we can not only save for our retirement (I'd love to be able to retire someday!) but also for college for the kid, and we even have some savings put by for a rainy day.  I think we could get by on one salary, if one of us were to stay home to teach the munchkin, but we'd lose a ton of money - and if the breadwinner ever were out of work, we'd have a serious crisis with healthcare (I'm diabetic, so I need me some insurance or we're out $20K/year on medical supplies alone) in addition to rent and food, once we went through the savings.

I suppose it's the same, financially, as the nonworking parent who doesn't teach the kids - but, homeschoolers, how did the money issue impact your decision? (I'm  genuinely curious here - would be interested to hear from people).

Alice handily addressed Amy's objection about the perceived religiosity of homeschoolers.  While those with certain religious beliefs do represent a large (and vocal) portion of homeschoolers, they are by no means the totality.  (BTW, I am a Christian and do intend on teaching evolution in science curriculum and discussing creation in religious/philosophical curriculum)

I am looking into homeschooling primarily because it occurred to me how little the public school system contributed to my true education.  Were it not for a couple of "lucky breaks" (to counter unfortunate ones), the public school system could even have damaged it irreparably.

To leahsmom: Some people use only the public library and other "free" materials to supplement the interactive learning they give themselves.  Also, I'll have to be lead instructor though I'm the breadwinner since my wife isn't quite as confident in her education.

The public library is one of the  best resources for homeschooling parents!  We aren't homeschooling yet, but go there at least three times a week. In our town we also have an educational lending library which caters to homeschooling families and has a wealth of games, educational toys and books, support groups...  Also, don't forget the added benefit of your child  being able to attend a college class, as a teen when appropriate, to fill in anything the child wants to delve into more heartily,  with the "experts".  My neighbor,  who is homeschooled, takes physics at our local community college, another teen homeschooler I know just finished a course on Japanese and  did fabulously.  And if there is something your child is longing to learn that you don't feel qualified to teach, but they are not old enough to take a college class, you get to find out more about the subject  together!  What could be more inspiring and interesting than having your parents joining in the learning process with you? Children have a natural desire to learn (if it's not squashed out of them by the public school!). They will amaze you with their natural curiosity and enthusiasm-and it will become infectious!

There is a great legal research paper out there right now on the Social Science Research site  written by some lawyers on homeschooling. It is quite lengthly, but very enlightening. I would recommend downloading it and then printing it up  in order to really take the time to read it well.  I think it could answer a lot of questions/concerns many people have about homeschooling: papers.ssrn.com/.../papers.cfm

Here, also, is a list of  comments written by credentialed teachers on the subject of  homeschooling:  californiahomeschool.net/.../teachercomments

This link is to an opinion/editorial on why this particular person believes homeschooling is more beneficial to children: www.associatedcontent.com/.../homeschooling_is_more_beneficial_to.html

So glad we can have this wonderful lively discussion! Thanks for the forum Amy!

I think it's interesting that so often the people who have issues with home education are teachers within the public school system, as Kyle is. Interestingly, over the years I've run across my fair share of teachers who think the PS system is great - until they have kids of their own and they join the ranks of home educators.

I've always homeschooled my kids, and yet I firmly believe that there is a need for public schools - home education is not for everyone. For those who are willing to take on their child's education, however, homeschooling offers countless opportunities. Time to explore subjects in depth rather than turning off the interest at the sound of a bell, freedom to study Egypt in kindergarten, instead of hearing, "we're not talking about that right now", and the ability to wait until a child is *ready* to learn, instead of pushing a state's agenda. (My youngest -13- was a late reader and would surely have been tagged as "special needs" in school - now he's reading at college level.)

I'm fully aware that I can't be everything to my kids, so when topics come up that I'm not well-versed in, I seek outside help. We find tutors or mentors that can fill in those gaps. My role is not so much 'teacher' as it is 'facilitator'.

People are so judgmental about other people's choices, especially when those choices don't follow the mainstream philosophy.  Folks, it is about educational choice.  I live in CA which was recently ranked 46th in the nation in education.  There are teachers out there who, for all their education, have no idea how to educate children, or allow children to educate themselves.  In the words of George Bernard Shaw - "The idea is the have the child in pursuit of knowledge, not knowledge in pursuit of the child."  Think about it.

I'm an atheist so I do not homeschool for religious reasons. There are so many reasons to homeschool.  And to think it's about keeping kids away from the diversity of the world is naive.  Most homeschooled kids have the world as their classroom, they are out and about with people of all ages, all colors, all cultures quite a bit more than their public schooled peers.

Our job as parents is to guide our children into adulthood with proper social skills and the ability to think for themselves and be able to make their own choices.  Public schools teach children what to think, not how to think.

Do some research, read some books, meet some secular homeschoolers, unschoolers, eclectic schoolers before making judgments about things you know little about.  

As a homeschooler, I get so tired of hearing our lifestyle bashed by folks who don't know anything about my life, my family's choices or the values that drive those choices. I'm all for public schooling if that's what works for YOUR family; what's your issue that makes you call my kid's education "claptrap?" I mean, you either buy into a certain set of values or you don't. I don't buy into the mainstream educational values and so we've opted out. You feel comfortable with them so you've opted in. So it goes.

As to those who wonder about the finances? If our kids end up in school the most likely reason will be money (since my almost 12-year old loves HSing and my almost 5-year old assures me she will, too). It's been hard to balance my freelance income with my husband's full-time income but HSing has been important enough to us that so far, we've made it work.

And may I say that our kids are thriving -- socially, emotionally and academically.

Here's an interesting take one homeschooling and why it works:

www.whiteoakschool.com/.../outliers-and-homeschooling.html

"As a member of the public education profession, I can tell you honestly that time and again I see students whose parents realize they can't be everything to their children and enroll them in school only to find them socially inept and years behind academically."

You do realize that, "As a member of the public education profession," you're seeing a select group of kids and parents for whom homeschooling wasn't a success and that your experience only tells you about that group and nothing about the homeschooling community at large. It's selection bias and a poor basis for forming opinions.

Imagine a doctor who declares walking is dangerous because he constantly sees the people with broken ankles and hips for whom walking wasn't a success.

"I certainly wouldn't take my kids to my neighbor to have a cavity looked at or try to fill their prescriptions myself."

Sorry for picking on you Kyle but when your kids need help in math do you take them to a mathematician? When their writing skills need some work do you seek the aid of a professional author? If they fail a biology test are you calling up a biologist to help them out?

Can someone please explain what "unschooling" is. It sounds like it would be pretty different from homeschooling, although the words seem to be used together in a lot of articles.

Unschooling is the lack of formal schooling.  My children and I live an unschooling lifestyle, which means that there is nothing that is required, there is no formal curriculum--unless they want and ask for it.  We learn through life, through living an enriched life.  It is based on the idea that children will natural learn what is necessary.  Obviously, this approach doesn't work well in an environment that is in rich in learning, where everyone is reading and writing and learning all the time.  It is similar to the idea that when we have a new baby, we don't immediately enroll the child in walking or talking classes.  We know that a normal child will see walking and talking as valuable skills and will strive to learn to walk and talk, with no direct instruction.  So it is for reading and writing and math.  If a child lives in an enriched environment where those around the child are reading and learning and enjoying those activities, than the child will strive to read and learn.  Obviously, it is important to keep the environment rich--my children and I are constantly active--museums, historical sites, book stores, park days, beaches, historical parks, girl scouts, soccer, and more!

We do not homeschool for religious reasons.

AND, I'm a single mom, who works full time as--uh, wait for it, a public school teacher.  

Unschooling really works, my 13 year old is working at a college level and is starting, next week, her 3rd semester at college. She currently has a 4.0 gpa.  Both of my children are well adjusted, work and play well with others, and are highly educated.  The majority of us (myself included) was taught (by our own educational experiences) that we needed to not just be taught, but to be told what we needed to learn, and when and how.  Unschooling lets go of all of that.  It's been amazing to watch my children learn and grow.  Alexx's scores on the placement tests, at age 13, were better than most high school graduates starting college.  

You don't really need to know everything in order to homeschool.  My personal goal was not to teach math or science or history or reading, but instead to teach my children (and my students at school) to love learning, and to be self directed life long learners who are capable of finding mentors and teachers to help them learn whatever they wish.  This should be the goal of all educators.

Joylyn, thanks for the response. What do your kids do during the day when you are teaching? I know most of us assume that you need to be at home full-time to homeschool or unschool.

My wife and I homeschool her brother-in-law who has ADD.  When we took him out of school 2 years ago he could hardly read.  Now he reads quite well.  We are not professional educators, but we know him well enough to know what works and doesn't with him. For instance we've found that workbooks bore the life out of him while combining exercising with memorization games works fantastic.  

Unit studies also work well.  Unit studies are single topics examined from different angles in order to enable homeschool teachers to teach math, reading, science, social studies and other school subjects while learning about the topic.

So instead of saying ‘now we’re going to start math,’ you tell your child ‘now let’s learn more about xyz (fill in something he's interested in here)’.  Since he’s already intensely in the topic, he’ll automatically have a more positive attitude toward learning.  Also, since school subjects such are taught while learning about the topic, he gets to see how such subjects are used in real life and how they are related to his favorite hobby, sport or other interest.

Kevin Broccoli, Author of the Homeschooling ADD Kids blog at homeschoolingaddkids.com/blog

I homeschool my children, ages 10, 7, and 4.  

We do not homeschool for religious reasons.

We've had many years of experience with public schools, as our oldest child, a high school senior, has attended public schools for all but 7th grade.  She chose to homeschool that year, but then also chose to return to public school the following year for 8th grade.  My 10 year old attended 2 years of public school, and my 7 year old attended only Kindergarten in public school, before they both asked to leave public school and be homeschooled.

Although homeschooling is truly a lifestyle for us, I can also see how some people "don't get it", as Kyle states.  For those who do not themselves enjoy teaching and learning, who do not want to spend every waking moment with their children, or believe solidly that they cannot create a teacher/student relationship with their child, homeschooling probably isn't a good choice.

Kyle, your statements regarding dental care insinuate that you believe all individuals who have been "educated" in dentistry are actually good at it, which further leads the reader to conclude that you assume all those trained to be "teachers" are good at it.  in our personal experience with our own children, who have a combined 14 years in public schools (my oldest skipped 3rd grade - at the school's recommendation), this could not be further from the truth.  we have lived in 3 separate states during that time,  and our experience involves 7 different schools - so do not assume that i am speaking from limited exposure to just one school or district.  this adds up to somewhere in the ballpark of 30 teachers in all, and i can tell you that maybe 6 of them have been "good" teachers.  maybe.  and only 3 of them were "really" good.  of the others, we've had teachers who ridiculed tiny children regularly, often handed out worksheets and then left the room for an hour or more without first offering ANY instruction, left tiny children alone and unsupervised for lengthy periods of time (during one of these episodes, a 6 year old actually chased my own child with a sharp object, telling her he was going to stab her - and this was in a very wealthy, very elitist little community), a first grade teacher who actually hit one of the children (and was never fired or even severely reprimanded), a third grade teacher who forced her students to cheat on a standardized test (same elitist little school), many teachers who outright ignore children while they are bullied, beaten, or are asking for help with their schoolwork, english teachers who cannot read or write adequately themselves, spanish teachers who do not know the language nearly well enough to teach it, teachers who have been accused multiple times of sexual misconduct with young students but who are allowed to remain employed at public school, teachers who yell and swear at their young students, teachers who ignore sexual harrassment between students, and on and on and on.  if you think that a teacher is adequate simply because they were given the job at your child's school, you better look closer.  whether you accept it or not, public school teachers are not skilled at what they do simply because they managed to acquire a college degree.

i do not personally have a college degree.  despite that fact, my children are currently working 1-3 grade levels ahead in all subjects.  we also study piano, cooking, and spanish. our science study goes much deeper than anything they would be exposed to in our local public elementary school (even though it's considered a "good" school).  we have an annual pass to our local zoo and visit twice a week on average.  we will soon be visiting the local science center just as often, and we are frequent visitors of our local library.  we also travel to various places around the country to enhance their education - for instance, after studying westward expansion, we traveled what was basically the california trail, saw firsthand the area where the donner party were stranded, and then stopped in gold country to pan for gold in the river.  this year, after studying astronomy and marine biology, we will be visiting both griffith observatory in los angeles, and then washington state to observe whales in the wild.  my children are computer literate, learning to type, use the different applications within MS office, and my 10 year old is well able to navigate the internet.  clearly, their educations are flourishing, despite my lack of a college degree.

it makes me hopeful to continually see the number of homeschooled children on the rise.  so many children who would have been completely failed by the public school system have been given the opportunity to succeed and flourish at home, regardless of the contrasting teaching styles that exist among homeschooling parents.

in case you are not aware kyle, finland ranks highest across the board for education.  if you read about the methods of finnish schools, you will find that it isn't uncommon for those children to be welcomed to school by a roaring fire in the school lobby, not hounded by tardy bells, permitted to walk around class in their socks, relax on the sofa in their classroom, and fed quality food while at school.  sounds similar to a homeschool environment, if you ask me.  additionally, they don't begin their basic education until the age of 7, and they complete it in 9 years, as opposed to the 13 years that U.S. children attend, and they STILL leave our public school students in the dust.  clearly, many things are not working here in U.S. schools.

what's more, my oldest child, regardless of what state or school district we happen to live in at any given time, has been exposed to drugs and sexual behavior every day at public school from 8th grade on.  every day.  sometimes, it's the teachers talking about their own drug use!

you don't know what you're talking about, and stating an uneducated opinion often leaves one looking foolish.

I was asked what my kids do during the day.  My children are as busy or not as they choose... They have sleep overs, go to park days, go to homeschool activities, reading, working on the computer, sleeping, eating when they are hungry (not when some school district says they need to eat)...  My 13 year old gets herself to and from the college campus, 2-4 days a week, depending upon her class schedule.  When they were younger, they stayed with another homeschooling family, now they are older and it's different.  They still go with other families for different activities.  Each day is different, each week is different.  

It's not easy, to be a single, full time working mom and homeschool, but when something is as important as the education of your child, you do what is best, not what is easiest.

Joylyn,

I think they meant, what do your kids do during the day while you are working full time as a single mom-at least that's what I'm curious about. :)

sorry joylyn, you DID answer that question!

I have never met a homeschooler in college.

Not once.

I wonder why that is.

Probably because their parents cannot come and approve their curriculum and argue with a professor who thinks even slightly differently from them.

Parenting doesn't mean total domain over your child. Let them explore the world, try different modes of education. Your children's love for homeschooling is probably just your words being parroted back.

Probably the reason Sara thinks she has never once met a homeschooled student in college is because they don't look any different than other college students.  So far, four of my six children have received their bachelor's degrees, and two are working on graduate degrees.  They are "normal," socially adept, hard-working young adults.

"I have never met a homeschooler in college."

Sara, that really says nothing about homeschooling and only gives information on your own individual social experience in college. To get some real and proper data from which to form an opinion you might try calling up the admissions department of your college and ask them if they have any homeschoolers. You might recognize calls others colleges and universities and see if your hypothesis had any basis in fact. You might search for studies on college enrollment rates for homeschoolers.

Your working on an opinion formed from nothing more then a personal anecdote. On top of that you build a hypothesis supported by nothing more then stereotypes. Flimsy doesn't begin to describe your line of reasoning.

Wow, Sara you are really defensive and misinformed...Or is it just uninformed? Homeschoolers see the world more than those that aren't homeschooled because we aren't bound to the school schedule. Our kids also have friends of various ages, ethnicities and economic background. Not so when you are sorted by zip code and age in the traditional school arena.

Are there bad homeschoolers? In every group there are bad examples.

Amy, Unschooling is a form of homeschooling but not all homeschoolers practice Unschooling. Does that make sense? We are not unschoolers so I cannot really speak of it, except to say that we don't practice that form of education.

Sara, please research Stanford University and other universities like it who have special admissions programs for homeschoolers--not that they need help getting in; the materials they have to offer for admissions considerations are different.  Also, read what about the homeschooled these universities find interesting and/or unique: initiative, desire to think critically, curiosity, etc.

As well, many homeschoolers take classes at local colleges while they're in "high school" because their parents may understand their limitations when it comes to things like calculus, etc.

Please also pick up a "Cookie" magazine from a few months back.  It had an article about a family that saved up money, had mom and dad take a year off from work, had the kids leave school for a year, and had the kids homeschooled for the year while they travelled around the world.  Do you think those kids, 8 and 11, would have had an easier time exploring the world around them from inside a building that looks a lot like a prison and from within a system designed to create obedient individuals?

Joylyn, you are to be admired for your dedication to your children's education.

Kyle, I would take my kids to my neighbors if my neighbor were a dentist.  I've actually taken my kids to my neighbor's when they were sick or injured--my neighbor is a doctor.

As well, I would allow myself to teach my own kids English because I have an advanced degree in my field and 11 years teaching experience--none in public schools because I am not certified; yes, elite public schools and charter schools that out-perform neighboring public schools will have me, but not the public schools.  However, I am uncomfortable bringing my children to a building that looks like a prison in order to put them on an assembly line and have them learn from people whose professional credentials might only be an undergraduate degree in education and a state certification (and little knowledge of the discipline that s/he teaches) and who relies on the ever-changing educational fads to tell him/her what s/he should be doing.

And who travels with my children on this journey: people who believe in the god of sports, the god of television, the god of video games, the god of technology, and the god of consumption and people who find education as a means to an end rather than an end in itself.