Strollerderby

Why do they need to have marriage rights? If the kids are fine already why must they push for marriage?

I don't see how granting marriage rights to same-sex couples is really going to lessen societal discrimination.

Why shouldn't everyone have marriage rights? Anyone who thinks marriage is not for everyone is just bigoted. The only way to lessen societal discrimination is for people to stop being jerks.

Twyla: see, Brown v. Board of Ed.: "separate is inherently unequal"

Isn't it a little obvious - if the state stops discriminating, it reduces societal discrimination because... the state is part of society.

Oh, for crying out loud, Twlya.  Do you know how many tax breaks and legal rights married people get?  Why shouldn't two people who have made a commitment to each other and their children be entitled to them?  

Imagine being with someone for 20, 30, 40, years and not being able to make critical medical decisions, not being entitled to anything if they die, being treated as an interloper when in reality you're the one who should be making the decisions.

I guess the better question, Twyla, is why do YOU need marriage rights, and why should "they" be any different?

TokyoRose said:

Oh, for crying out loud, Twlya.  Do you know how many tax breaks and legal rights married people get?  Why shouldn't two people who have made a commitment to each other and their children be entitled to them?  

Imagine being with someone for 20, 30, 40, years and not being able to make critical medical decisions, not being entitled to anything if they die, being treated as an interloper when in reality you're the one who should be making the decisions.

Not only are same sex couples not aloud these rights, if they have children together and one dies the other partner has no leagal right to their very own children.  No one should be aloud to tell you that because of your sexual orientation that you can't have your own children.

I am in a heterosexual relationship and we have been together happily unmarried for many, many years. But the tax breaks you get when married have convinced us that jumping the broom is where it's at! Everyone! everyone should have that right. Not to mention that when something as big and invisably powerful as the state you live in tells you something is wrong with your parents love for one another you are bound to get some hurt children.

I would love to read Twyla's answer to lovedannygansle's question!

Okay, here is my answer:

1. I apologize if my they sounded like "they". I meant it to identify who I was talking about but not in a mean tone.

2. Marriage is defined between a man and a woman and has a religious background. I would like to see the union of same sex couples called something other then marriage.

It is obvious to anyone who reads my comments that I am a conservative. That does not make me a bigot or a homophobe. I simply voice my opinion on this blog as that is what it is for.

Twyla, you're entitled to your right of free speech and your opinion. No one can take that away from you.

That said, what you're suggesting is unfair and anti-equality, which is why people are going to argue with you. Allowing gay and lesbian couples access to civil marriage makes our society more equal, more free.

Why call it something else and set up a whole bunch of new rules when society already has a time-tested institution we all understand and honor: marriage.

No religion will be forced to honor same-sex unions, but some religions already do. Religious thought on this matter seems to be divided.

Marriage in this country is traditionally a civil matter anyway. No one is required to go to church to get married — you can go to City Hall.

Amber, exactly!

Twlya, I'm sorry if you don't like the word bigot, but that's what you are if you don't believe everyone should have the same rights. Just as you are free to voice your discriminatory opinions here, we are free to criticize them.

Bigot: (as defined by Webster) a person who is extremely intolerant of another's creed, belief or opinion.

Let's analyze this: I am not extremely intolerant of another's way of living. I do not intrude into anyone else's life. Do I want gay marriage allowed? No, I don't. Do I protest it and speak slanderously of those who do want it? No, I don't. This moves me to the category of opinionated and not that of bigoted.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "extremely intolerant." I think it's pretty extreme to voice the opinion that YOU should have rights that THEY should not have.

Also, this is the definition from Merriam Webster online:

bigot

One entry found.

a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices ; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

— big·ot·ed Listen to the pronunciation of bigoted \-gə-təd\ adjective

— big·ot·ed·ly adverb

I think you prove my point that I am not a bigot. I have not treated anyone with hatred. I am far from hateful.

I don't tend to agree with many commenters on this site. I don't think they are all bigots for having an opinion different than mine. Wouldn't, by your opinion definition, you also be a bigot for obviously displaying intolerance towards my opinions? Are you bigoted towards conservatives? If so, when is bigotry wrong? When it is not agreeable by you?

My point is simple, I have a different opinion. It is mine. I share it here because I think that is the point of the discussion that follows the article. I do not post hateful things nor do I call people names in my comments. Not agreeing with you does not make me hateful or intolerant.  

I guess it depends on what you mean by "extremely intolerant." I think it's pretty extreme to voice the opinion that YOU should have rights that THEY should not have.

I have tried to clear up the "they" issue. Let me try one more time. They is referring to the people in the article. I suppose I looked at the picture and decided that was the family. My bad. I was not saying they as though people living a homosexual lifestyle are somehow a subhuman group.

Would this be better?

Why do [homosexual couples] need to have marriage rights? If the kids are fine already why must [same-sex partners] push for marriage?

Actually, I think the problem is that you ask why anyone needs marriage rights. You never answered the question of why you need marriage rights. Why don't you just have a civil union? Also, how will same sex marriage affect you in any way? Why should it bother you at all? Marriage equality wouldn't stop you from being married. You would also still be free to privately consider marriage as something only between a man and a woman. The state should recognize marriage of all committed couples who choose to get married. Sooner or later that WILL happen, whether people like you like it or not.

Am I bigoted against conservatives? I guess it depends. If you aren't the sort of person who believes in equal rights, then you are the sort of conservative I don't care for much. Some conservatives don't feel the way you do. Obviously there are liberals who don't feel the way I do.

I got married because of my spiritual beliefs and only for that reason. We had a tiny ceremony for morality sake. I need to be married because I feel that is what pleases God.

What kind of conservative am I? I would really like you to explain that to me.