Strollerderby : separation of church and state

Choose Life License Plates Debate Heats Up

JeanneSager — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 16:32:00 GMT

If you're a pregnant woman, do you want to get stuck in traffic behind a car sporting a "Choose Life" bumper sticker? What if it wasn't a bumper sticker but a license plate, supported in essence by the taxes you pay and the state government by virtue of their oversight of the department of motor vehicles?

It's a fight raging in the North Carolina House of Representatives right now, and one that's been cropping up in other states. Are choose life license plates allowing the religious right to get its hooks too far into government?

Judges in Illinois, Arizona and South Carolina have summarily dismissed the proposal to add them to the fund-raising options in the department of motor vehicles' repertoire, citing the topic too controversial. In North Carolina, the current debate is over whether "choose life" is a political issue because civic groups are eligible for special plates but political issues are specifically not allowed.

Its proponents, of course, say it's political in the sense that it is free speech. That's why the pro-life Children First Foundation has taken the State of New Jersey to court over the plates - citing the state for denying them their Constitutionally protected rights. They've pointed out that individuals pay for the right to have the special emblems on their plates, an extra fee that goes to help support the department of motor vehicles as a whole - so pro-choice people aren't technically funding a pro-lifer's message. If anything, they'd be benefitting from it with the funds raised that offset our taxes.

But it's hard to separate license plates, issued by a government entity, from the emblems printed on them. Even if a pro-lifer paid for that emblem to be there, it still stands that the government allowed them to put it there, even took their money to do so. What's next? Nazi symbols printed on license plates? If this is a matter of free speech, than why not? Although I am very decidedly pro-choice, I am not equating the general pro-lifer with Nazis.

But I would ask whether pro-lifers are ready to have the government supporting pro-choice emblems printed onto their license plates, at the behest of the state. A bumper sticker bears the opinion of the driver, a license plate is representative of government.

And my baby, my body don't belong there.

Image: WRAL

Separation of Church and State=Same Sex Marriage

Shannon LC Cate — Thu, 30 Oct 2008 01:00:00 GMT

Finally! Someone from a religious perspective is talking sense about gay marriage. (And it's in the newspaper.) Joseph Conn, spokesperson for Americans United for the Separation on Church and State told the San Jose Mercury news:

"At its heart, the marriage issue is a church-state issue...In effect, you have several of the large faith groups trying to impose their viewpoint on marriage on the whole state. That's really what's going on with this referendum."

Precisely. Civil marriage is a legal status granted by the state. It has nothing to do with religious marriage which is granted or not by religious traditions in a wide variety of ways. Hence many same-sex couples have received blessings on their unions from their religious communities but lack any civil rights based on legal marriage. Hence, same-sex couples in states that marry them have those civil rights and may or may not have received any kind of blessing from a religious entity.

I have long-believed that the confusion people have about the difference between what a religious entity does in marrying and what the state does in marrying is the crux of the disagreement about "gay marriage." Churches will never have to marry same-sex couples if doing so offends their beliefs. Think about it. No church has to marry anybody now if doing so offends their beliefs. Most Roman Catholic churches won't marry non-Catholics unless they convert and/or the non-Catholic member of a couple promises to allow any children to be raised Catholic. Orthodox Jewish rabbis often have similar policies. Various churches I have attended had requirements to marry that included church-based premarital counseling, church membership of a year or longer and even a history of contributing money to the church.

In spite of these rules, the Roman Catholic Church is not lobbying to outlaw marriage for non-Catholics. But that's the level of absurdity to which religious opposition to same-sex marriage falls.

In this country, we have something called freedom of religion. That means we are free to practice or not practice any religion we choose. It also means we are free from the government making laws based on the beliefs of any particular religion and enforcing them upon everyone.

And this married, Christian, lesbian mom says thank God for that.

Update: No License Plate For Florida Believers

Amy S.F. Lutz — Wed, 30 Apr 2008 17:31:00 GMT

Ah, the power of the pen! Not unlike the historic works of Thomas Paine and Simone de Beauvoir, I'm sure it was my indignant post on Florida's proposed "I Believe" license plate that caused lawmakers to drop the design from the legislation package passed yesterday.

Or maybe it was Don'tFearTheReaper's threat, "If the jesus groupies get a license plate, I want a plate that says "I dont give a [expletive deleted] what jeebus would do, get the [expletive deleted] outta the passing lane driving 35 mph."

Or maybe - if it's not too hopeful and idealistic to think so - the voices of reason and sanity triumphed in the state senate, with the majority of pols realizing that the plate was a clear violation of the separation of church and state, which they may not necessarily agree with, but is in fact a cornerstone of our secular democracy.

But hang on to your hats, Reaper and other offended readers - South Carolina is also considering the same plate design, and state senators there approved the bill yesterday. It now goes to the state's House of Represenatives.

Evolution Bad: Ben Stein’s Intelligent Design

Cole Gamble — Tue, 22 Apr 2008 17:31:00 GMT

We interrupt your regularly scheduled animosity toward Scientology with this Religious News Break. Did you know there is a conspiracy to squelch the teachings of Intelligent Design from our schools? Once again those fat cats at Big Science are choking us with their “truths” when what our children really clamor for is the rebel yell that is Intelligent Design.

At least, that’s what Ben Stein wants you to think. Stein stars in a new documentary called Expelled which asserts that creationism must be taken seriously by scientists. Among Mr. Stein and the filmmakers’ persuasive points: the theory of evolution paved the way for the holocaust…

Bueller? Bueller?

Expelled just opened last Friday, so if you want to catch it, you might wanna go soon. I predict it will have a short theatrical life and then enjoy a resurrection of cult-like following on DVD.

Before I jump into my rant let’s get to the questions for you. I realize I might make a lot of assumptions about our reading audience on Babble. Perhaps there are more intelligent design supporters out there than I give credit, so let me ask: do you think there is room for intelligent design in school curriculums? Is there room for it anywhere? Do you think it’s harmful to view it as a credible alternative to evolution?

Still here? Okay. Here’s MY big question: Why do science and religion have to go head-to-head ever? Pardon the cliché, but they are apples and oranges. In my mind, the two deal in categories of thought completely exclusive from one another. In other words:

Science looks for KNOWING. How do the chemicals in our brains create the sensation of love? How do they create pain?

Religion looks for MEANING. What does love mean? What does hurting mean?

As I have mentioned before, I believe faith and reason can coexist, we just need to know where they belong. Knowledge belongs in schools, faith belongs in churches. I don’t know why understanding the separation is so hard. I wouldn’t swing a bat in a china shop, nor would I bring an antique vase to a baseball game. Religion is a philosophy. It’s meaningful, but not fact. Biblical fact is not fact. You can’t apply the tenets of any philosophy to answer a scientific matter. That’s why you will never see a mechanic fix a Volkswagen by applying the Socratic Method.

Trying to shoehorn faith into the construct of science is as ill-fitting as, well, trying to pass a camel through the eye of a needle. Intelligent design is a closed system. Where science is always reaching out for answers, intelligent design draws a box around everything we understand and calls everything outside that box “God.” Case closed. Makes it hard to find new cures for diseases when you’ve already determined that is unknowable. Back in the early days of man, when there was no science only religion, the average human lifespan was under 30. If you are reading this and over the age of thirty, science is what got you here. Intelligent design, not so much.

How many minutes does Intelligent Design have left in the public’s attention span? Intelligent design just doesn’t seem like a concept that has legs. (You might argue it’s always been there, but thrusting it as an “empirically” proven theory to sit along side evolution seems like a rather modern and perhaps desperate positioning.)

Finally, it kind of hurts my heart because I had a soft spot for Ben Stein, silly old conservative he is. Yeah he was a speechwriter for Nixon. Yes, he’s responsible for Jimmy Kimmel, and by extension, responsible for The Man Show. His stint as host of a game show that might have actually been harder than Jeopardy gave me the impression that he is a man who puts intelligence first, not “intelligence.” I met him once and he seemed like a genuinely nice man (not that he shouldn’t be) full of curiosity. We were in a theatre I worked and he grilled me about the history of the theatre and this crazy thing called “improv” that we performed there. He just struck me as someone who valued knowledge and wanted to know more about everything he encountered. Oh well.

Strollerderby : separation of church and state

Choose Life License Plates Debate Heats Up

Six-year-old Goes to Traffic Court

Is Pay to Play At Public Schools Fair?

Motherproofing the Motor City

Separation of Church and State=Same Sex Marriage

Update: No License Plate For Florida Believers

Evolution Bad: Ben Stein’s Intelligent Design