Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Neal — Fri, 22 Aug 2008 13:48:55 GMT

What is ironic, is that the women voted FOR these suits; it was not some chauvinistic drum beating tribunal of men.

Again I repeat : THEY CHOSE THEIR OWN SUITS

Get over it, by the way, I hear the Amish are looking for columnists

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Pat — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 21:47:29 GMT

Are you serious? As a male I'd rather go shirtless when diving around in sand. Can you imagine having a bunch of sand stuck in your shirt while trying to jump higher than the net. The bikini actually would be easier to maneuver in while retaining the least amount of court. I vote men wear bikinis. they must need the top to put their name and number on....We must all go out and get lives!

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

leahsmom — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 14:16:13 GMT

I also have been thinking the same thing. Not only are the women practically clothesless but when they're wearing the white outfits, you can practically see through them.

Granted, many athletes might prefer tight/little clothing because it is easier to move in or interferes less with play. So I can understand that it might be legitimate. But even if it is, that doesn't change the fact that women's bodies are sexualized, even in sports to a much higher degree than men's will ever be, and that leads to some inequality in how we view professional athletes of different genders.

Another example - you don't see male gymnasts "dancing" in sexualized ways with their uniforms up their butts on the floor exercises - it's pure athletics, there.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

trollmommmy — Sun, 17 Aug 2008 15:13:32 GMT

Oddly enough, I think that the women BV players look way more comfortable than the men. The men look really hot and uncomfortable in their outfits. Maybe everyone should boycott the BV segment until the men have to wear a similar outfit (really short running shorts?. But instead of making it a feminist issue which would be blown off, we should say we just want the mens to be as comfortable as the women and we see a case of reverse discrimination.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Isa — Sun, 17 Aug 2008 00:12:42 GMT

I have been saying the same thing all week. Every time I turn on the tv it's beach volleyball and the mini bikinis. It can't be that important to be aerodynamic for volleyball, and why don't men need to be too? Makes no sense.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Karen — Sat, 16 Aug 2008 17:58:02 GMT

Lars, you make some good points.

Lars wrote: "What message do young girls take home when they repeatedly see appropriately, comfortably dressed men achieving in sports while women are barely covered whether participating in the sport or cheering the men on in theirs."

I'd also ask, "What message do young boys take home?

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

lars — Sat, 16 Aug 2008 02:36:47 GMT

I have begun censoring the family consumption of sporting events since having two young daughters. BV is one piece of a huge puzzle in sports that encourages society to value women only for sex appeal. What message do young girls take home when they repeatedly see appropriately, comfortably dressed men achieving in sports while women are barely covered whether participating in the sport or cheering the men on in theirs. The problem is not skimpy uniforms - it's that it's never the men who are in them.

Incidentally, Phelps' uniform is functional. It just happens to look sexy on him. I can live with that combo. But if the BV argument goes "the less clothing the better",

why don't the guys get the Michael Phelps treatment? Frankly, it's obvious to me that the uniform policy exploits female players' bodies for ratings.

I'm willing to donate my valuable time to help design new uniforms for the men's BV teams. And let's keep those cameras low... and in front!

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Mamallama — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 21:59:59 GMT

Karen,

I absolutely agree with you 100% that there is a lack of equality that needs to be addressed and I am not naive to the situation that anti-feminism exists.

I think I was maybe overreacting to the ignorant tone in the original post (sorry Brett) and the fact that some of the "feminist" postings on Babble lately seem to think that women cannot be taken seriously unless fully clothed, regardless of their own personal choice (feefifoto, c'mon....disgusted, really?). There should be freedom of choice and equality in all sports and it is not happening fast enough, but it is happening here and there.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Karen — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 19:19:28 GMT

Amanda and Mamallama,

I did play competitive indoor volleyball (on the inter-collegiate team of a 60,000-student university); so, I would hardly suggest that these are not incredible athletes, especially the beach players. Nor would I suggest that they are demeaning themselves with their uniforms. And I can see why some would truly prefer to wear more minimal uniforms for practical rather than social or promotional reasons.

However, I think it is naive to deny that the uniform rules are anti-feminist, particularly in light of the asymmetry of the men's and women's rules. It is not a coincidence that the players are wearing what an unabashed sexist might want them to wear. I'd really prefer for both men and women to have more choice in the modesty of their uniforms, although I appreciate the desire for some uniformity of uniforms.

And yes, some of the female (and male) players are complaining, some louder than others. Most acknowledge the inequity but think there are bigger battles to fight. Other female players think that they should use every advantage they have to promote the sport, which would lead to more equity, say in tournament payouts. I disagree. Who's right? Hard to say. Either way, we still got to go a long way, baby.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Kaz — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 18:16:53 GMT

Yeah, Brett, I love ya man, but I think you're reaching a bit on this one...

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Mamallama — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 17:27:44 GMT

I do think that the men go shirtless in the regular AVP tour...the shirts is an Olympic thing. And by the way, the female players aren't complaining.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Mamallama — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 17:26:02 GMT

Clearly some of the women responding to this post have never played beach volleyball (or indoor for that matter). Playing in sand is difficult and the bikini does lend itself to ease of movement and less places for sand to gather. And why should you care what they wear? What happened to supporting athletes for their achievements? And if you are so concerned, what about Michael Phelps who wears his speedos as low as possible? I certainly don't mind!!

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

SL — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 14:18:44 GMT

Yes, totally annoying with the bikinis (and to whoever said it's okay because the bikinis aren't sexy - ask a dude - those bikinis are sexy).

Though, to be fair, one of the original ideas behind the Ancient Greek olympics was to look at pretty bodies. Though from a feminist perspective, it is a little worrisome. I think they should be allowed to wear clothes - or the rules should have the men go shirtless.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Amanda — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 06:11:38 GMT

Not to deny that promoters of beach volleyball want the bikinis for commercial purposes, but if you watch the sport for ten minutes it's pretty clear how elite these athletes are. And it is significant that these bikinis, however small, aren't actually provocative -no push up bras as far as I can tell. BV seems to be more difficult than the indoor version of the sport. Running and jumping in sand with only two players covering a large area is beyond difficult. Don't we owe these ladies some respect for their obvious prowess? And don't we owe it to them not to imply that they are demeaning themselves? This is hardly Amanda Beard in Playboy.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

feefifoto — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 05:37:43 GMT

I don't deny that they're way more athletic than I am, but I've been disgusted by the bikinis since BV became an Olympic sport.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Brett Singer — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:33:47 GMT

Thanks - correction appended. Also didn't realize the bikinis were an actual written rule.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Karen — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:24:05 GMT

Mom2Two, I believe the rules forbid the men to go shirtless.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Tiffany — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:14:32 GMT

I will be the first to call myself a feminist and am usually one of the watchdogs out there noticing inequalities. But to set the record straight, there is both women's and men's beach volley ball and indoor volley ball.

Just today I watched the American men squeeze ahead of the Japanese men in a very heated beach volley ball tournament. Don't you love the Olympics?

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Mom2Two — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 03:00:24 GMT

The men beach volleyball players wear shorts and sleeveless shirts. If the women wear tiny bikinis, why can't the men play shirtless?

And those bikini bottoms are cut so they look like they'e intended to creep into buttcracks.

However...if my body looked like Kerri Walshes or Misty May-Traenor's, I'd probably wear a bikini year round.

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Karen — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 02:35:24 GMT

Thank you, Brett, for including a photo of actual game play. The Globe and Mail, the supposedly "high brow" national Canadian newspaper keeps using shots of body parts only. Nary a face or a ball to be seen. Good Grief!

re: Volleyball hasn’t come a long way, baby

Karen — Fri, 15 Aug 2008 02:32:14 GMT

Um, just to clarify: There are both beach and indoor events for men and for women.

But, along your line: You don't know the half of it. For women, the uniform rules _require_ indoor players to wear bum-huggers, i.e, hot pants, and beach players to wear a two-piece suit.