No Antibiotics for You!

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 04:36:41 GMT

Logicalmama,

I'm sorry if I was insulting, but the comparison to religion and crystals is valid in that none of these treatments can be falsified so they are pseudoscience. I am not saying, nor have I ever said that western medicine is the cure, but science and the scientific method is. This isn't being closed minded, despite your hysterics. The lack of definitive answers is science at work as new knowledge becomes available and old ideas are discarded. When homeopathic remedies are put up to real scientific studies with double blind controls there will be something to discuss, until then it is merely placebo, wishful thinking, and "this is better than nothing" home medicine.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

LogicalMama — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 04:19:14 GMT

Treespeed,

These stories are not anecdotal; they are reality. I totally understand the idea of a placebo and brought it up b/c you mentioned it, not in comparing it to homeopathy. I am not religious and would never classify homeopathy with religion or crystal healing and you are going overboard in making those comparisons. Medical investigations are run all the time and the pendulum swings back and forth so even medicine can not be relied upon as curing. One day it's good for us, the next day, it's deadly so please.....?! Nothing is definitive, but I have seen homeopathy work and I am not a quack or an idiot so don't insult me!

I am going to take the high road on this one.... I will no longer put my energy into your close minded outlook nor will I engage after you choose to make personal attacks in your comments.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 04:01:40 GMT

LogicalMom,

The study you cited had no control population so it would not be scientifically significant. The reporters have a bias to report positive results of their treatment and the population they are treating have already self-selected this particular form of treatment. It’s great that these folks had a positive experience, but I’m sure that you would see similar results of any treatment compared to the results of no treatment. But that’s the problem with this study there is no comparison. 87% were satisfied with homeopathic treatment that they sought out, compared to what, compared to no treatment, compared to traditional treatment? I’d post something about scientific controls, but that’s just my western medical bias.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 04:01:40 GMT

LogicalMom,

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Fri, 28 Mar 2008 01:16:09 GMT

LogicalMama,

I quoted from wikipedia as it was convenient, any other reliable medical or scientific source would state the same conclusions. Homeopathy is a pseudoscience.

Can you say anecdotal? Those are all nice stories, but I'm also sure that someone could post lots of nice stories about prayer curing their afflictions too.

You cannot investigate a medical treatment that cannot be falsified. The whole Western medicine conspiracy is just an excuse for a practice that cannot be scientifically tested.

And I think you don't quite understand the idea of a placebo. If you are arguing that in some cases a placebo can be effective, that's true of course. But this is not an argument for homeopathy. Unless you are arguing that homeopathic medicine is nothing more than a placebo, and with that I would completely agree.

The FDA doesn't test homeopathic remedies because there is nothing to test so by default they are all deluded or scam artists. If you are claiming that saline or sugar water contains the energy or memory of a substance you have left the realm of science and medicine. How would you like it if you went to your cardiologist and he suggested crystal treatment?

You really need to change your screen name.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

LogicalMama — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 19:59:19 GMT

Here is a link to info about research done abroad where homeopathy is more commonly practiced, respected, accepted and investigated....

www.medicalnewstoday.com/.../34046.php

re: No Antibiotics for You!

LogicalMama — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 19:53:33 GMT

Treespeed:

Wikipedia is a wiki that ANYONE can post info to. I would never take info from Wikipedia as fact, period! Please quote more credible sources. The "lack of scientific evidence" is completely telling... there has not been enough research to say whether it works or not...

But I can tell you from personal experience with a schooled homeopath that my son was cured after one remedy of a condition that western medicine could not manage (we tried for a year!). This was not a placebo effect b/c believe me, I tried placebos during the year we tried prescriptions. Her remedy worked and I know that as FACT....

I also know that one of my son's friend's had suffered from asthma for years and was a chronic user of steriods and inhalers. He was treated by the same homeopath and has been off all his medications since. As well, his chronic cough-- GONE! THis homeopath got into it b/c of her child's issues with excema, asthma, ect. Doctors were not helping, she tried homeopathy and it worked!

Of course, a MEDICAL REVIEW would call homeopathy quackery. Not to diminish the need for western trained medical doctors, but for many acute and chronic ailments, homeopathy can be extremely effective and if more people prescribed to it, would leave many general practitioners twiddling their thumbs!

We are a nation that relies on pills to cure everything that afflicts us. Most pharmaceuticals are mere bandaids, working only to suppress a condition which only prolongs it. For each pill there is a list of side effects. Often taking one pill leads to a handful of more pills to manage the side effects from the others. Homeopathy gets to the source of a problem and allows the body to naturally work it out and then returning to a natural balance that encourages health.

Absolutely, there are ineffective homeopathic remedies out there; companies cashing in on the FDA NOT monitoring this field and taking it seriously. But if you know where your remedies are coming from (Haunemann Clinic versus over the counter) and if your homeopath is experienced and educated, there is GREAT SUCCESS in homeopathy.

I too, believe in other natural remedies... Rue/Fennel as an eye wash to prevent and cure pink eye. Osha root for on oncoming chest viruses. Simply using a neti pot daily to keep allergens and colds at bay. Healthful diet, exercise and Red rice yeast extract for cholesterol management instead of taking statins. I also believe there is a need for pharmaceuticals. I am not an extremist, but I am a realist and I am not always going to take what the doctor tells me as gospel. I am going to make fully informed decisions in matters of health and sometimes the doctor is not fully informed, they are driven by outside influences that are bigger than me!

And by the way, the placebo effect has been proven as effective in many maladies........... that is why it is called the "placebo effect!"

re: No Antibiotics for You!

rrr — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 18:52:02 GMT

'Homeopathy' and 'natural remedies' are not the same thing. The theory behind homeopathy (Wikipedia: "Homeopaths believe that the methodical dilution of a substance, beginning with a 10% or lower solution and working downwards, with shaking after each dilution, produces a therapeutically active "remedy", in contrast to therapeutically inert water. However, homeopathic remedies are usually diluted to the point where there are no molecules from the original solution left in a dose of the final remedy.[109]") doesn't seem very logical to me, so I don't use homeopathic remedies. But I do use other natural remedies - echinacea, garlic, etc.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 18:24:32 GMT

Sorry if my earlier posts were "spew"

Hopefully this bit from wikipedia is clearer.

Claims for efficacy of homeopathic treatment beyond the placebo effect are unsupported by scientific and clinical studies.[7][8][9][10] Meta-analyses of homeopathy, which compare the results of many studies, face difficulty in controlling for the combination of publication bias and the fact that most of these studies suffer from serious shortcomings in their methods.[11][12][13] The ideas behind homeopathy are scientifically implausible and directly opposed to fundamental principles of natural science and modern medicine.[14][15] The lack of convincing scientific evidence supporting its efficacy,[16] and its contradiction of basic scientific principles, have caused homeopathy to be regarded as pseudoscience,[17] quackery,[18][19][20] or in the words of a 1998 medical review, "placebo therapy at best and quackery at worst."

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 18:16:21 GMT

LogicalMama,

Unless you believe in faith healing there is no scientific difference between homeopathic remedies and a placebo.

I would think that someone who is logical would know that.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

LogicalMama — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 17:31:26 GMT

Renee and km, you can also put dry rice in a sock and microwave and it does the same thing. Again, it holds the heat longer than a wet washcloth. I just did this for a blocked tear duct and it worked wonders! 10 seconds in the microwave = 20 minutes of sweet heat relief.

Treespeed you are right about the middle ear infection and concern over the ear drum, however it spew that all homeopathy is snake oil is a little extreme. There are many natural remedies that could and should be used if antibiotics aren't necessary.

And Chris. oh, that is so gross, obviously a very good friend, indeed!..... I see the theory, but the visualization is sickening.... especially when I think of all the ears I see with wax kind of spilling over the outside of the ear! I know q-tips aren't supposed to go IN the ear, but please people, can't you swab the excess wax flowing out?!

re: No Antibiotics for You!

menotyou7 — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 15:59:35 GMT

I'm finishing up my PhD in microbiology right now and I have a gross fact for you. On a cell by cell basis, you are actually outnumbered in your own body. There are more bacterial cells on your body at any given time then there are cells that make up your body. At least you always have company :)

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Renee — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 01:44:51 GMT

A variation on km's method: microwave a potato for a couple of minutes, then wrap really well in a towel, and hold to the ear. The steam heat helps relieve the pain and pressure very effectively, and the potato stays warm much longer than a cloth. But be careful to wrap the potato well, as it can get really hot.

(Knock on wood, haven't had to do this yet with my son, but have done it countless times on myself, as a child and adult)

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Cassie — Thu, 27 Mar 2008 00:47:35 GMT

Motrin relieves the inflammtion and swelling.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Treespeed — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:40:45 GMT

Garlic oil and homeopathic drops sound nice, but do NOTHING for a middle ear infection or did everyone forget about the eardrum? It's amazing how otherwise intelligent people will buy the most useless snake oil if it has the words natural or homeopathic on the label. I should start selling my own brand of natural medicine... I think I'll call it Placebo.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

km — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 22:37:15 GMT

My 5 yr old just had his first earache--which developed, of course, on a Sunday. There are tons of homeopathic remedies, involving a variety of drops in the ear (just google it), but be careful--putting drops into an ear with a ruptured ear drum is not safe.

That being said, one of the kid's ears was so red and inflamed, I didn't want to chance putting anything in it, so we ran a clean washcloth under hot water, squeezed the water out, and had him hold it on his ear. Once the washcloth cools, just repeat the process. Within about 5 minutes, he went from screaming and whining his head off, to being able to nap for a little while.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Stef — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 21:02:39 GMT

Hyland's makes good homeopathic earache drops. Garlic oil is a natural anitbiotic and is great for earaches, just put a few drops in the infected ear, with tylenol to relive the pain. Oh, and try to relax, if you can relive the pain the body will fight the infection.

re: No Antibiotics for You!

Chris. — Wed, 26 Mar 2008 20:43:16 GMT

This is going to sound gross, but a friend of mine did this to me when I had a bad earache, and it worked: she just put her mouth over my whole ear and gently sucked. It relieved the pressure, and made it feel better. I'm not going to give any more details than that...