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In our latest episode of Right Mom/Left Mom, we discuss how we think the different candidates will handle women’s issues, the “war on women,” and more!
You can find Kristen Howerton blogging at Rage Against the Minivan, or avoiding housework over at Facebook or Twitter. Other posts you might enjoy:
Kristen Howerton is a professor of psychology and mom of four children within four years via birth and adoption. She's been blogging at Rage Against the Minivan as a coping skill since 2006.
[...] Kristen Howerton and I are discussing women’s issues today in our Right Mom/Left Mom series. Today we discuss the “war on women” and I share why being pro-life is NOT anti-woman. WATCH AND WEIGH IN HERE! [...]
I’m a little confused by your discussion on the contraception mandate. The mandate says that employers must cover contraception for their employees. From what I understood both of you saying (which maybe I misunderstood), consumers can choose which hospitals they go to, which is true, but the mandate is more talking about employees of Catholic hospitals, not their patients/customers. That makes things stickier because I don’t think everyone who works at a Catholic hospital subscribes to that Catholic doctrine, nor do I think they should be forced too. Also, not everyone takes birth control pills for birth control. As I’m sure you know, the pill can treat conditions such as ovarian cysts and endometriosis, and in Sandra Fluke’s testimony before the Senate, she said some times women have a hard time proving to Catholic institutions that they indeed need their birth control pills for legitimate health reasons.
Also, according to the White House, the mandate has been revised so that women who work for these institutions who object to birth control can bypass their employer and get birth control directly from the insurance company without the institution having to pay for it or provide it. So I’m kind of confused why this is still being called an infringement on religious rights. http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2012/02/10/fact-sheet-women-s-preventive-services-and-religious-institutions
I really agree with the understanding that you both mentioned that, despite being pro life myself, I do not think the law is going away or changing. In fact, on an earlier episodes comments I stated that and really got forcefully told off in the comments. I would never say that I like this truth, but abortion is here to stay.
That said, I think the important thing is helping women who find themselves in an ugly situation and providing all the care and support we can.
I also am a bit concerned with Romney’s views on women. I do think that the war on women rhetoric is over the top and I really don’t think Romney cares at all about my vagina. With that, though, I do think his views on women are quite antiquated, and in line with many more Christian fundamentalist ideals. He is a strong and devout person of his faith, so therefore he probably agrees with the Mormon understanding of women’s roles.
However, I do think it is possible to govern one way, understanding how the world works, and personally live differently. If he could understand that the country is not made up of only Mormon people (which I absolutely think he does), then hopefully he will be able to govern in a way that benefits the whole and not some of the parts.
Do I think this will happen, though? I just don’t know. For some reason I just don’t trust him. The way his wife talks about him makes me a little nervous and I do not appreciate the ways he has talked about women – and you guys didn’t mention Paul Ryan, but he scares me greatly in regards to women. I actually think he is the reason the ‘war on women’ rhetoric is what it is in this election. If Romney had gone with a different candidate I’m not sure this issue would be nearly as volitile.
Thanks for the conversation!
Kristen’s Mormon comment about Mormons having very fixed, Biblical views on women…I have to speak up just on that. So not true! It tells me that either Kristen is reading very narrow commentary on the Mormon community (likely written by non-Mormons) or knows very few Mormons personally. I am Mormon and boy howdy do my husband and NOT fit that stereotype. While we have a few Mormon friends who fit a more Biblical idea of how to treat women (for one, that means to me submission to a husband), we know far MORE Mormons who are not anything like the stereotype it seems Kristen holds. I hope you can take some time and maybe meet some real-life Mormons who don’t fit the stereotype…that stereotype is one, very minor and small segment of our population.
Julie, I actually have many, many friends who are Mormon. Most of my understanding comes from hearing their frustrations on this issue. But to be fair, many of my evangelical friends share the same frustration, so it’s not exclusive to Mormons.
@Charlotte, I share your confusion/concern. In “free market” theory, employees are treated as consumers in the job market, sometimes to the point of ignoring the concept of bounded choice.
Regarding the revision to the employer mandate, I think some remain concerned because this new policy exempts only not-for-profit organizations. Some for-profit employers whose owners object to particular forms of birth control are not given an exemption under this policy. For example: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/24/hobby-lobby-birth-control_n_2010354.html?utm_hp_ref=business&icid=maing-grid10%7Chtmlws-main-bb%7Cdl1%7Csec3_lnk3&pLid=225237
I agree that kristen should investigate a little deeper on the mormon issue from reliablesources. The best would be getting to know more mormons. If thats not possible watch the profile videos on mormon.org. they are excellent examples of how mormons are extremely diverse though we all should share common beliefs and values. Trust me there are many “powerful” working women on this site such as drs and dentists and stay at home moms. Whether you mean to be or not it is offense when you make blanket statements about members of the church before you have a full grasp on the topic. We have a lot of jehovahs witnesses in my area and a couple of people have said oh they are just weird. I refuse to believe that about any culture or religion unless i have spent some time getting to know and understand the people themselves. I am not going to go to someones arch enemy to find out the positive qualities of a person. Nor am i going to make a conclusion about a group of nearly 14 million people based on one politician or a lame anti mormon play. I would like to think we have an ally in you kristen because i think the base of your beliefs is that we have a savior jesus christ who atoned for our sins and with out that we are nothing…same here. And in case it matters im not voting for romney…im not overly impressed with obama either. Its turned into a smear campaign on both sides and that does not appeal to me. Third party candidate maybe? I dont know.
I agree with both of you that we should all stop using the phrase “War on Women”. It is polarizing and really doesn’t make sense since it would mean so many women are at war with themselves.
But the issue that bothers me is more subtle. I hate the term “Women’s Issues”. I think women on all sides of the issues need to really rethink their use of the term. It is like the “Bic for Her” pens. “Women’s issues” has the subtle implication that all the other issues are “Men’s issues”. Women are about a whole lot more then abortion and contraception. We care about foreign policy, the economy, education, immigration….. I think all women across the political spectrum can agree that we shouldn’t continue to re-enforce stereotypes about ourselves.
I really, really enjoyed this video. I did find one comment by Kristen a little offensive- “The Catholic church’s position on birth control is ridiculous”- as a Catholic woman. These sorts of decisions made by the Catholic church were not made lightly; in fact, they were made with the utmost respect for women in mind. The problem with the birth control pill and certain other birth controls (like Plan B) can cause a woman to have an abortion, whether she realizes she is having one or not, by making the uterus a hostile environment for the growing fetus. Condoms are a separate issue that I do not quite understand the Church’s teaching about. So yes, I’m pro-life, and I am pro-women, being a woman myself (I always like to think that abortion kills future women, so it’s ironic that people who think that they are pro-women by supporting abortion are actually anti-women!).
Wow, this is an extremely encouraging post, and certainly welcome with all the Democrat-Republican slashing back and forth lately. I’ll be glad when this election is over! Anyway, I have a comment directed to Kristen. Kristen, I am asking this in a nonjudgmental way, but when you said that you think Catholic’s view on birth control is ridiculous, have you actually read why it is the way it is? As a Christian, I am sure that you don’t mind reading or hearing about other faiths, so I was a little surprised to hear that. Again, I am not trying to be offensive with this comment, so if it comes off as such, please know that it is unintentional
.
In regards to why I think the Catholic stance on birth control is ridiculous: for the most part, I think it’s ridiculous that they ban the use of condoms, since clearly there is no “potential abortion” there. I also think that, medically, it’s not true that the pill causes an abortion. And while I think that it’s fine if people choose not to use that method because they think it’s morally questionable, I also think it’s irresponsible of the Catholic church to shame families into having more children than they would like when there is no scripture indicating that family planning is a sin.
I think the fact that Romney was supportive of women having flexible schedules is great. And the binder of women thing is just silly. He went out of his way to make sure there was female representation. That’s the point. Also, I can’t figure out why it would be a bad thing for a woman to like the idea of cooking for her family? Don’t most person now want a job that is flexible so they can do the things that matter? Cooking dinner for your family matters, in my opinion. Of course, my husband sure can do it (and he is WAAAAY better at it) but I love to be able to serve my husband and children. And not in a sick, slave type of way. In a way that is giving and from my heart. Again, in my humble opinion, we need less “me” talk/actions in this country. Service. Service. Service. That’s what changes the world.
Well, I’m Democrat, Mormon, & a woman. I take no offense to Kristen’s comment about Mormon’s views on women. While I believe Mormon feminists do exist & are growing in numbers, myself included, I also believe the standard view is antiquated, and that Mitt Romney has shown himself to be a sexist & out of touch. If I recall, in the fact checking of that second debate, it was determined that Mitt did not seek out the women for his cabinet as much as the women’s groups were approaching him in more of an affirmative action cause, & that the positions those women held were actually lower level positions in his cabinet. In my view, that wasn’t the greatest answer to the question of lower wages for women. I am also pro-life morally & pro-choice politically. I think history has shown what happens when abortion is outlawed, they will happen anyway, & many more women’s lives will be lost as well. I don’t believe religious institutions should be strong-armed, but found the comment about the employees vs. patients interesting as well, and I also have a hard time seeing the issue there. In my view, any statement of war that actually isn’t a war is simply extreme & meant to inflame. But oh how I despise all the ignorant & sexist comments coming from the mouths of the GOP candidates regarding the funding of Planned Parenthood, abortions, & rape. It certainly does not endear me to their cause.
@ Verity3 I saw that there still exists a gray area of for-profits having to still provide contraception when they don’t agree with it, and I get why they see that as a rights infringement. However, I just know that a lot of women need birth control pills to control actual legitimate health problems, and I think they should have access to them. I’m lucky enough to have a job with insurance that pays for most of mine, and I can afford the $10 a month I have to pay for mine, but until this mandate not every woman has had that awesome deal. I think this mandate allows women to have healthier lives, and in the end, I think your employees’ health is more important. But I also live by the creed that people shouldn’t enforce their beliefs on others, for example: Hobby Lobby, a Christian company, refusing to pay for employees birth control pills because the company thinks birth control is wrong, even if the employees believe that it is a legitimate health need. That imposing bothers me more than the government saying Hobby Lobby has to pay up for a woman’s birth control pill. But that’s just me.
Maybe the word “ridiculous” is what’s upsetting people. For the record, I agree with you. Family planning is not wrong, in my opinion. (Neither are unplanned pregnancies, though our society tends to think so.)
I don’t think the Catholic stance on birth control is ridiculous, however. Even if there is no proof text supporting it, a biblical argument can still be constructed from a broader, theological view.
I personally think there is nothing wrong with barrier methods, but I don’t use birth control pills. I do see medical evidence for the possibility of an abortion. And even my obgyn (who does prescribe it and rolls her eyes at people who decline for ethical reasons) admits that an abortion can occur in a rare case.
So I’m not as extreme, but I still respect their viewpoint.
This is one small voice of dissent: I am a mother through birth and adoption. I was reared and educated in the Catholic faith, although I not a practicing Catholic now. I do believe strongly in contraception and abortion. Many, many problems of the world can be laid at the altar of rampant reproduction. We need to stop sending aid in the form of vaccines and nutritional supplements and start sending Norplant. That would be my contribution in support of women everywhere.
So interestingly, I now have to say that perhaps Kristen is not “left enough” and would recommend that both of you take some time to read about the war on women … even wikipedia has sufficient information to get you started,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_on_Women. This is not just about reproductive rights, though certainly women are the bearers of that burden by a HUGE margin. It’s also about defining rape, protecting women from domestic abuse, equal pay, and has even included the media’s insistence on portraying women as body parts.
And to those who think that it’s nice of Romney to let women take off early to fix dinner, pay attention to Obama … the ability to balance your work and your life is a FAMILY issue … it’s not just for women anymore.
I love what you both have to say, and am huge fan of you both. Since I’m from Mississippi, I can tell you exactly what we faced last November. There was an amendment on the ballot that you may have heard about – what they call “personhood”. If that amendment passed, the INTENTION was to outlaw most forms of contraceptives as well as IVF. I’m talking about birth control pills, IUDs – the most reliable forms of birth control. So that’s what we were up against, and it certainly would have outlawed abortion in our state. Like Kristen points out, the best prevention against abortion is good sex education as well as access to birth control. Sadly, MS has a dismal teen pregnancy rate, and near complete lack of sex ed in our public schools. Paul Ryan IS associated with personhood, and many of the Republican candidates have signed personhood pledges as well. Now, that may not be worth much, but it lets you know where a politician is willing to go. I understand that the phrase “war on women” may be polarizing, and I like thinking of it as it affecting FAMILIES. It really does. Every family should have the right to plan their families as best they see fit. Full stop. So, that’s why we’ve been ranting about our vaginas. Because we’ve had legislators pushing laws into every bill they could to try to tell us exactly what we can’t do and must do with ours. I’m not a fan of that, and I’ll fight it every step of the way.
@Mel B., It is not at all true that the birth control pill can cause abortion or exists to make the uterus a hostile environment. The birth control pill prevents ovulation entirely, hence making it completely impossible for sperm to fertilize an egg, because one has not been released. So from that frame, I agree with Kristen’s assessment that the policy is ridiculous. It treats any prevention of ovulation or fertilization — birth control pill or any barrier method, including condoms — as sinful. Which is confusing. And not just to non-Catholics, because I am a Catholic. The problem with a straight-line abstinence-only solution is that it fails to recognize humanity, in my opinion. Even in the presence of morality, we falter. Yet by taking away all of our choices, whether by lack of education or a legal ban on options, it serves to punish us for being human.