I think this whole article is BS. If you’re ashamed of putting your childs’ photo on an internet website then lets just all shoot ourselves now! Lets put paper bags over our kids’ face when we go out in public because we don’t want a stranger looking at them…Whoever wrote this is very immature and is “trying” to be heard. I use my daughters picture as a profile picture quite a bit…Its my way of saying “I’m proud of her”. Aren’t there worse things to worry about? Like putting our 12 year old girls on birth control for example…Now THAT is a story to tell!

Obviously, Roiphe speculated and oversimplified (like many popular press authors). It’s interesting just how defensive of a response she encited. I mean, she never said she doesn’t like your children (or anyone else’s), and she didn’t intend to single out one woman or another. It *is* an interesting observation that so many women (and men) display their children in a profile image, and I can see her argument shadowing arguments that follow the history of motherhood (what it’s meant over the years and what it means now). Women *have*, at times in history, lost their autonomy after becoming mothers.

Is it *because* she’s an academic? Is it because her status — her identity, excludes her from being speculative?

PS -
Who cares if there are more important things to discuss — she’s discussing her observation that there are lots of kids faces on mother’s profiles on facebook. Can you imagine how the world would be different if we were all evaluated by how *important* the subjects that we talked about or wrote about were?

I think anyone who’s really exercised over this should read this single salient point and explain what they think is wrong with it (and be prepared to defend yourself against those of us who think that YOU are as important as your offspring are):
“One

I’ve put my kid’s pics on my fb because they are much cuter and skinnier than me. Sad but true.

For someone who claims not to care what Katie Roiphe thinks or about the cultural relevance of Facebook – you sure devoted a lot of time and energy and space to the topic.

It’s even worse when a guy puts a picture of his girlfriend (he’s not hiding, he’s bragging – and so are the mothers) and you spend a a few minutes wondering who would name their daughter “Travis.”

Women like their kids. Is that a big revelation or an anti-feminist statement? Women are proud of and enamored by their kids. Putting their photos on Facebook is like flashing their photos from your wallet.

……and maybe someone choses to use a photo of her kids as her profile picture just because she can’t find one of herself that she likes ’cause she always looks red-faced and blotchy!!

mamazee73, no offense, but I think you totally missed my point.

In the portion you quoted I said, if staying at home is for you, do it. I also said, pretty much exactly what you said, a lot of women aren’t fortunate enough to make that choice. Maybe because their families can’t afford it, because their spouse doesn’t agree with them that this would constitute a job, because they live in unsafe neighborhoods and a daycare is better than their homes, because they are a single parent, etc.

You can make this choice. Other people can’t. But if we pretend everybody has “choices” we don’t have to recognize that no, not everybody does.

I think the notion that there are heaps of feminists out there telling people to reject their kids is a strawman (woman?). There are certain types of feminists that espouse that, sure. And some of them do see children as a route to oppression. It’s not because children are inherently oppressive, or that caring for them is not without joy, but because they recognize in our current culture women who leave the workforce to raise children have a hard time getting back, that there are residual pay disparities because of maternity leaves (just held up by the supreme court!), that parenting by yourself can be lonely and tedious in a disconnected world and that it’s not enough for all women.

Like I said, I would rather focus on changing these social forces than shaming individual women. But I won’t pretend that problems don’t exist, even if you think that makes me a “hard line feminist” who wants you to reject your children (which is nonsense, I’m home part time with my own).

I agree with you Jeanne, my guess is that the original author is an old school second wave feminist. Both ways are trying to get at the same thing, women need respect and parity for what they do– be it child care or in the work force– Rolphe is focusing on the short term, women’s behavior and how it damages people’s perceptions of them (they’re only maternal, they are just their children) rather than working on larger structural issues. I’m always on the side of working on structural issues, not shaming women.

Still, I do get tired of people who brush aside all feminism has achieved (especially the second wavers, who now are “strident”) by repeating “choice” over and over.

Ann05: very interesting article. And good point on incomes, etc. being disproportionate.

But I think that only proves the argument against Roiphe – that being proud of parenting isn’t what women need to be fighting here. It’s the lack of good maternity leave laws, lack of good paternity leave laws, etc.

Brett, I love this post and I love you.

Brett (and others), I am totally with you on this. I was incensed by Roiphe’s stupid and condescending article also. I, too, posted it on my FB page.
I admit, though, it DID give me pause if only to remind myself that YES, I am a mom but I am also ME. That is not a bad message…but I don’t need Ms. Roiphe “reading into” my decision to put this or that photo on Facebook, geez!
Thanks for weighing in!

Thanks for your dressing down of the academic babble! I really agree. My take on Facebook, in my circle of friends, is that it is for catching up. I find high school friends, old drinking buddies, college professors. What better way to get people on my wave length than a few pics of me and the babe of mine?? I see her point though- there are women who have literally no pictures of themselves. I was aware of that “issue” when posting my own kid’s pics. However, parenting is consuming. Whether you’re a woman or a man, it takes everything you have. I like being able to show off my cute kid as part of my life too. Thanks… L

Sometimes my FB photo is my child. Sometimes it is of me with my family. Sometimes it is just of my husband and I. Other times I use photos from my college, high school or elementary years. What does all this mean?

These photos represent many phases (all important) in my life. Why would I exclude my son, any more than I would exclude my best friends from college.

At the end of the day, feminism is about how you live your life as a woman and support others. Too often (as seen in this article) women are far too quick to criticize others. Maybe Katie should focus more on supporting other women instead of bashing them.

I’m pretty sensitive to anti-academic attitudes and I didn’t see Brett as showing one here. But maybe that’s because I think to call Katie Roiphe an academic is using the term too loosely.

I personally don’t like it when women put their kids as their own profile picture or use “so-and-so’s mother” as a handle online. But I’d hardly bitch-slap them about it. It’s their business.

I put lots of photos of my kids on FB and being a mother is actually a big part of my professional identity too. There’s lots of nuance Roiphe is missing for a cheap shot at headlines. Typical of her, if you ask me.

I noticed a long time ago that my male friends on Facebook use a photo of themselves but almost all of the women have a photo of their child or with their child on the profile. Why? Is that our identity? Are men bad fathers for not doing the same? I think women diminish themselves in many ways and this is one of them even though it is subtle. Yes, we are proud of our kids but my husband does not need to talk about them all of the time. Why are we so reluctant to stand alone without our kids? Maybe it has become our identity as our jobs outside the home once were, as those jobs often are to men. At social events the first question asked of a man is “What do you do?” Women as asked, “How many children do you have?” No one ever asks that question of a man until they have talked for a bit. It is almost as if it is too personal of a question to ask a man but no one thinks twice of asking a woman such a personal question first of all. Women are not as respected as men. When we a pregnant everyone touches our bellies, gives us unsolicited advice, gets into our business. Men are never in such an exposed position. But worst of all women allow it. In the US is is still assumed a womans’ identity is dependant up her children and home and the mans’ identity is dependant upon his career. Things are not changing very much. You may not like it but it is true. And it is our fault.

See, I come from the no kids on the profile pic for a different reason. I worry about safety. I don’t think it’s safe to have pictures of your kids publicly available. I have no problem with tons of pix of them available to friends & family, but would be uncomfortable with them viewable by complete strangers. I also like pix of myself only viewable by friends. My profile pic is a closeup on my eye. Certain friends use pix of pets or cartoons. The profile pic is viewable by all. Maybe I’m paranoid, but I think some effort to control personal information and your image should made.

DSF – I see your point. I also think Brett overdid it with the self deprecation, but the “hating on” stuff from Meg/Catherine seemed a little strong. I guess if I were supersmart and armed with impressive credentials I wouldn’t give a hoot how some poor sap (kidding) characterized academics in a blog.

People (Meg, Catharine) who see this piece as anti-academic/anti-intellectual must be interpreting much differently than I. Or are very insecure about their own associations with the academe and/or intellectualism.

Are our Facebook pages really that reflective of our lives as a whole? Half of my friends have “what’s your stripper name” quizzes on their Facebooks, does that mean they’re destined to be dancing on poles next week?

Yes, my daughter is my FB picture at the moment. This story makes me more inclined to keep her there! Because part of being a feminist is embracing women’s rights to choose when and how to be parents instead of having it forced on them. Or perhaps Roiphe would prefer we return to the olden days when women had to pretend they wanted what they were “supposed” to want? Because now, apparently, we’re not “supposed” to want to be parents. We’re supposed to want careers and to read good books.

Funny, I have all three – and I still like my kid the best.

No need to be so self-depricating, Brett. You make some very good points, and I agree with a lot of what you said.

Whenever someone has such a judgmental reaction to something as harmless as posting a picture of your child for your Facebook profile, or, in Rosin’s case, breasfeeding, I can’t help but wonder what nerve was struck. I think Roiphe’s essay says a lot more about Roiphe’s insecurities than it says about feminism, parenting, or women in general.

Too many cheap shots to make this a worthy argument. And yeah, what’s with all the anti-intellectualism and academic-hating?

Roiphe should go and cuddle with Hanna Rosin – they both believe they know better than everyone else while telling us we all suck.

Roiphe is a little out of touch with reality, methinks. She should walk off campus once in a while and talk to real people.

I am very tired of women attacking other women, whether under the guise of feminism or the mommy wars or whatever. Just because we all have the same body parts doesn’t mean we’re all going to think and act the same at all times. I’d rather retain my individuality over any feminist cred I might have.

Also, FB is not that important. Come on.

Hmmmm…I can’t say that I use my FB page as my identity. Its actually used to keep up with farflung relatives across three continents. Rellies who have never seen my child and request frequent updates and pictures .

What’s with the hating on academics? Geez.